Much has been written about QuickBooks tax tables. Here is why I thought charges were reasonable until we got a better way.
INTUIT MARKET SHARE AND PROFITS:
You should always base opinions on evidence. Please look at the certified financial statements Intuit files with the federal Securities and Exchange Commission. Those creating false financial statements can go to jail for long time and pay big investors big money. As a Certified Public Accountant I feel Intuit financials show a company that keeps prices low despite its near monopoly market share of around 85% for QuickBooks and 70% for Quicken and TurboTax.
Tax Table History:
In July 1998 QuickBooks 6 became the first QB to try to get us to upgrade tax tables. InfoWorld gave it the first Nagware Product of the Year Award. In December, 1998 because it nagged twice per paycheck, instead of once per payroll.
Risk Factors:
Price Increases:
End User License Agreement:
User Unfriendly Changes:
User Friendly Changes:
This was a big deal in January 2000. That is when QuickBooks began charging for each company that used payroll, not for each copy of QB. BlockTax gets free copies of QB with QuickBooks Certified Professional Advisor membership and beta testing. Our clients with payroll all get their own copy of QB. Many clients have us file their payroll returns only once a year, on owner payroll. So the tax table charges would have cost our clients and us little or nothing.
Some CPAs, however, were being asked to pay up to $3,000 a month to keep a $200 program current, so I worked hard to get per company charges dropped. A well known CNET reporter later said, "This major victory for consumers ... was almost certainly caused by a gigantic hue and cry in the Internet group ... "biz.comp.accounting." Block ... led the battle against the new fees."
Many changes have since made most QuickBooks users realize they get good value for their money. For example, Intuit lets up to five networked users use one tax table. Since January 2001 it also gave us a free table with new QB versions, good until 2/15 of the next year. The key is QB has long had 80% to 90% of small business accounting program users, so few seem to have found something they like better at any price. I also publicized the fact that Intuit had long made almost nothing in Net Operating Income. This means that they are likely charging too little, not too much. In view of their near monopoly status of QuickBooks, Quicken and TurboTax, I cannot understand why prices are so low.
Here is why the free tax table is the only one most users need. There are few important table changes during the year. Social security and Medicare rates have not changed in many years. The maximum tax for them applies to few QB employees and are easily entered. Unemployment tax rates are set outside the tax tables. There also are NO known cases where a government bothered a small business for using wrong tables when it only affected income tax withholding, starting long before there was a QuickBooks. This is because employees always get credit for amounts withheld, not amounts that should have been withheld. Employees who have more or less tax withheld than they should almost always even up by April 15 of the next year.
QuickBooks has been particularly good at keeping upgrade prices low. This is partly because they can give better more economically support if they do not have to spend time on old versions and related bugs. Y2K problems made them drop support for versions through QB 5 around January 1, 2000. They will stop supporting and providing tax tables for QB 6 and 99 by July 1, 2002. To encourage upgrades Intuit lets us to link to them and provide the Lowest QuickBooks Prices.
Complete QuickBooks Payroll @ $15 A Month:
Mike Block - QuickBooks Tax Cut C.P.A. Dec 23 2004, 6:42 pm
I am sure of my http://www.paycycle.com/ cost, but understand the confusion. Enter the site on
the middle right, saying "I am an accounting professional." This may also work for you:
PayCycle Accountants Wholesale Program
You will see:
Wholesale Program for Accounting Professionals $14.99/client per month for 1-5 clients $9.99/client per month for all additional clients
A linked page says:
The wholesale price is $14.99 per client per month. Your client receives PayCycle Payroll Plus. This is a flat fee regardless of the number of employees / contractors or the frequency of your clients' paydays. Furthermore, after you've obtained 5 active clients, you qualify for an additional volume discount where subsequent clients will cost just $9.99 per client per month. That comes to 75% off the regular retail price. PayCycle bills you directly - you decide for yourself how to bill clients. Client Retail Service Clients get billed the regular small business retail price, based on the service selected and number of employees. You are not involved in the billing.
I make the wholesale rate available to clients & non- clients, without obligation, as it costs me nothing. The company, formed by ex-Intuit people, has a QuickBooks export. They do not require a CPA for this wholesale rate and may give it to anyone. I would really like to know any difference between the wholesale service and the other Paycycle and competing services. By the way, they also do 1099s inexpensively. >Payroll can be done in Medlin and a batch entry can then be made to QB. I don't recommend Medlin accounting software, only the payroll module. A 10-year-old could use it.
C.P.A." <block...@mindspring.com> wrote:
You can use http://www.paycycle.com/ to outsource your payroll, with direct deposit and all tax returns. You also can quickly download their checks into QB. Your total cost through us is only $9.99 a month Microsoft is beta testing a planned QuickBooks killer for possible August release. Its payroll may come from ADP, who I found to be expensive and often irresponsible.
Your far better QuickBooks compatible solution is at http://www.paycycle.com/.
Ex-QB payroll people give 20,000+ customers an easy web interface to a complete outsourced QuickBooks compatible payroll service. It includes direct deposit and ALL TAX RETURNS. The accountant wholesale rate, which even non-clients get from me, is $10 a month, with a 2 month free trial. You can even submit information via email, fax or phone for $10 more a month.
At this price we will not even do payroll tax returns for once a year payroll clients. I will even help those who do not want Paycycle to have their bank information. I can do this with stockholder loan deductions that produce $1 checks on my bank account, if you promptly pay taxes.
Your QB tax tables service is now more expensive than the complete outsourced payroll service offered by http://www.paycycle.com/, They give you direct deposit, all tax returns, etc. Ex-Intuit people run this respected company. Your cost is our $9.99/month cost for up to 20 employees and very little more for extra employees. This is around 60% less than Intuit's Enhanced Payroll and 90% less than its Complete Payroll or comparable ADP or Paychex service. There are even more benefits if you refer several users.
You can enter payroll in a simple web form and easily download your data into QuickBooks. You also can inexpensively submit data by fax, email or phone. This fast quality service is a get acquainted offer, but you have no obligation to use us for anything else.
On the other hand, even if you do not use this service I would really appreciate your remembering this offer the next time someone says I always support Intuit.
STOP if you read this post from me in the prior thread:
Your QB tax tables service is now more expensive than the complete outsourced payroll service offered by http://www.paycycle.com/. They give you direct deposit, all tax returns, etc. Ex-Intuit people run this respected company. Your cost is our $9.99/month cost for up to 20 employees and very little more for extra employees. This is around 60% less than Intuit's Enhanced Payroll and 90% less than its Complete Payroll or comparable ADP or Paychex service. There are even more benefits if you refer several users.
You can enter payroll in a simple web form and easily download your data into QuickBooks. You also can inexpensively submit data by fax, email or phone. This fast quality service is a get acquainted offer, but you have no obligation to use us for anything else.
On the other hand, even if you do not use this service I would really appreciate your remembering this offer the next time someone says I always support Intuit. Simply send me the company name, state and approximate number of employees.
I agree that it is about time for someone to seriously challenge QuickBooks. Prior Microsoft accounting and tax program challenges have been very weak, but Office integration should give us a good version 1.0 program this time. I hope to soon confirm this with the beta. Of course, Intuit will have plenty of time to respond because the Microsoft program will not be out until late 2005. Then we all should benefit from a feature, speed and price competition.
Microsoft actually may be making a very bad mistake with this program. Intuit can easily include near free Microsoft Windows and Office replacements in its QuickBooks install. This may cost Microsoft more that $300 per user.
The Linux Windows replacements can initially boot from CD or jump drives without disturbing Windows. Crossover Office is one of several programs that now let QuickBooks, Quicken and most Windows programs run faster under Linux, with less current equipment. A free Open Office program is a near perfect Microsoft Office clone, which runs under Linux or Windows.
The learning curve for this will be far less than it was when we went from DOS to Windows. Are you too fed up with the time and money you waste on virus and adware fighting? Then you too may not wait for Intuit bundling. I decided after not needing any help at all during days of Open Office work. Tonight I paid $6 for a Linux magazine OS bundle.
I should soon have 6 and 12 year olds who can surf the web without needing me to clean their system.
Mike Block - Tax Cut C.P.A. Jan 21 2003, 7:14 am
On Mon, 20 Jan 2003 09:07:58 -0500, Mike Block - Tax Cut C.P.A.
Users may not like some limitations, but Quicken now runs on Linux.
http://www.codeweavers.com/products/office/
http://www.codeweavers.com/products/office/supported_applications.php...
According to the vendor you can use Quicken to prepare your taxes. This must mean that QuickBooks cannot be far behind.
Jack Hatfield properly pointed out privately that we cannot get QuickBooks running on Linux until we get a replacement for Internet Explorer. He also said I should check MyBooks, which seems to be as close as it gets so far. I agree, but keep hoping.
A second user, who did not give permission for credit, wrote that he was running Quicken on
Win4Lin under Mandrake 9.0. His post said, "The advantage of Win4Lin is that the Window
system is running as a task under Linux, so you do not have to worry about the API's not
being exactly as Windows or the running programs expect them. They are the Windows API's, not what Codeweavers thinks the API's are. I also have the programs running from and accessing the data files on my Windows partition, so if I run on windows, the data files are not in
sync, they are the SAME files.
I would like to get the sound working on Quicken, but the problem is that I haven't installed Quicken on the Window that is mounted on Linux. I believe the sound files have to be in the registry (the dumbest idea in software history) before Quicken can find them. The problem with installing is that I then loose all my updates. I keep hoping that Intuit will get smart and release a Linux version of Quicken."